📄 Archived: 2025-08-31 17:22:12 UTC
🔗 Source: https://old.reddit.com/r/Transgender_Surgeries/comments/14gmuq8/3_months_postop_clavicle_and_scapula_reduction/

# 3 months post-op, clavicle and scapula reduction

r/Transgender_Surgeries • by u/wyrecharm • 241 points

## Comments

u/wyrecharm • 39 points

As promised in my last post (https://www.reddit.com/r/Transgender_Surgeries/comments/12e77g9/3_weeks_post_op_clavicle_and_scapula_reduction/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3), this is a 3-month update on my clavicle reduction and scapula shave with Dr. Rogers in LA.

I'm happy. I'm so happy. I'm SO F'ing happy.

About the surgery:

- He uses long screws that fixture the two sides of the clavicle long-ways, instead of plates on the outside of the bone. The hardware is captured entirely within bone and there's no protrusion under the skin.
- 3 months later now, and X-rays show that I'm totally healed. I've resumed all normal activity, including tree climbing, running, and other exercise.
- I also asked him to shave down protrusions on my scapulae that I hated. More detail about that in my original post.

I originally planned to take meticulously matched before/after photos with identical clothes, angle, and lighting, but that's a PITA so instead I opted to upload a whole lot of photos both before and after, so that one can develop a sense of how I look in varied lighting and outfits.

The ones in this post exemplify the difference as I perceive it, but I put a huge batch of pics on imgur:

More before pics: https://imgur.com/a/GEwg76F

More after pics: https://imgur.com/a/erzGQIb

The thing that most people would be concerned with is the affect on range of motion and generally being worried about having a "broken" body from something like this. I put the picture of me climbing first to emphasize that I truly feel as good and limber as I did before. I think there's still a little muscle weakness from the retraction around my scapula, but it's clearly pretty good at this point. Of course, naysayers might say that the real cost will come many years from now, and for that I say I'll at least try to keep in mind the idea of posting an update after years from now. I'm not worried though.

About myself and my motivations:

During and after puberty, shoulder width was my biggest source of dysphoria by far. I'd even tried to DIY estrogen to stop this when I was in grade school and highschool, but this was in the early 2000s and resources for information were almost non-existent. That didn't stop me from trying OTC menopause supplements that didn't do anything. I was about an inch wider than the female average for my height (i.e. right at about the male average for my height). Maybe that doesn't sound so bad, but most of us know how dysphoria is.

When I was around 20 I started actual HRT and went full time a year later and went stealth a year after that. My only other surgeries to date are SRS and 2-stage FFS. I learned to dress very specifically with the intent to create the illusion of narrower shoulders, and avoided many (most?) styles at all costs. It's only since getting this surgery do I realize how much I've filtered my wardrobe and how freeing it is to not have to do that. I can *really* wear just about anything I want now.

Impression and thoughts on the aesthetic:

Obviously I love it. For the first time in my life I love my own body. I immediately saw the difference in the mirror, but I half expected family (like my mom) to say "I don't even see a difference". In fact she said the difference was apparent to her, so it's not just me. My husband grumbled about the whole thing, because, obviously, any loved ones are going to feel a surgery like this is silly and unnecessary, but he's happy that I'm happy and has pointed out that the narrower shoulders may have given me the impression of more cleavage. I'm also dressing in a way I wouldn't have before, so I suspect it's mostly (completely?) the different clothes.

When I catch myself in a mirror in a clothes store or something at a distance, I just feel great and confident now. I compared my width to my mom's, who's like 5'5", and I'm actually at least as small as her now using a consistent measurement technique, so again that's just amazing.

Another really awesome thing is that some tops I had before that were just too small because they were tight in the shoulder now actually fit. And well! I'd always worn Medium tops and tailored them myself to bring in the sides, and what a REVELATION to discover that I can now buy Small. Small! I'm a small now!! The shoulders aren't at all tight!

Finally, an unexpectedly great outcome had to do with the appearance of my clavicles under the skin. Before there were really bony looking and sunken above and below the clavicles. I honestly had NO expectation that their appearance (not just the shoulder width), would change, but WOW it's totally different. Just smooth now, which I like. People say that strong clavicles are striking and beautiful, but I'm MUCH happier this way. Just soft and round-y like I wanted... just normal. And with my scapulae shaved down (see my previous post), I feel so confident with strapless and other variants of tops, sports bras, etc. F*** it's awesome. SO happy.

The surgeons before/after pic (in the pics above) best show the difference in the bony appearance of the clavicles. The width difference is of course visible but nothing beats the in-person impression, which to me is significant. Note that the asymmetry in the his after image seems to have been from the way I was standing during the pic, which is unfortunate! It's totally symmetric IRL.

The recovery timeline went like this:

- 4 weeks: Got the first followup X-ray and Dr. Rogers reported normal healing for that stage. You could see a slight offset in the bone alignment where they meet, which I was warned about by Dr. Rogers, who said they would smooth out during the healing process. This seems an unavoidable consequence of the way the fixturing works and is both minor and totally symmetric. Not at all concerning.
- 7 weeks: Resumed running, although this was earlier than he recommended.
- 8 weeks: Got the second followup X-ray. Dr. Rogers reported some lucency still and advised to take it very easy if running. Otherwise good. The slight offset in the joint was less apparent.
- 10 weeks: I stupidly went off my normal trail and tripped over a root while running. Fell on my hands and pinched a nerve in my back. Was a little worried for a couple days.
- 11 weeks: Resumed running after nerve healed.
- 12 weeks: Third/last followup x-ray. Dr. Rogers reported that the bones were completely healed and that I could resume all activity, like climbing. There was no sign of the fall. Also, the previously noted offset was no-longer visible now that the bones fused together and rounded themselves out.
- Now: Added climbing back into my routine. Life is GOOD.

u/-Weeb-Account- • 9 points

I'm genuinely so so happy for you, I could cry!

u/wyrecharm • 5 points

Thank you SO much!

u/Jealous_Club_4315 • 5 points

Im planning to do it as well in the Philippines and stay there for a month after the surgery. But the thing is, when i go home, I’ll be living alone. Will i be able to survive the recovery process by myself from Week 5 onwards? Thank you very much.

u/HiddenStill • 1 points

Are you from the Philippines?

This is quite an unusual surgery and could be quite risky.

u/Jealous_Club_4315 • 2 points

Yes. I am from the Philippines. Are you from the Philippines as well?

u/HiddenStill • 1 points

No. I was just wondering why you were doing it in the Philippines since there's almost no information on surgeons in English.

u/Jealous_Club_4315 • 3 points

Yes yes. Im from the Philippines but based in Melbourne. Im scheduled to do the surgery on June 27 and planning to stay there until July 27. I’m just scared that it would be impossible for me to survive the recovery process after July 27 since I’ll be back in Melbourne where I love alone. Like is it ok for me to carry groceries? Can i cook by that time? Like all that.

u/HiddenStill • 1 points

I’d be concerned about complications. There’s not much information available about this surgery and complications could be very bad.

u/Ok_Radio_1716 • 1 points

Hey im from Sydney can you confirm if u went along with the surgery and the outcome of possible.

u/smowse • 1 points

Melbourne girl also interested in this - I've been looking at going to WIH hospital in Thailand, feel free to DM to discuss!

u/kytookay • 19 points

The results look fantastic! I’m so happy that things worked out for you 😊. How has the pricing been? It’s something I’ve considered, but was concerned with my field of work. Keep us updated as the months go on 😊

u/wyrecharm • 5 points

Eh it's not cheap... about $37k. I took out a personal loan, haha.

u/Influential_Urbanist • 3 points

Ok I’m late but that’s way too fucking expensive. I do absolutely need to get this but I don’t know how when they fucking price gouge you like this Jesus Christ. I’m getting FemLar eventually which Is like 15k and that’s already asking for way too much… Edit: oh and electrolysis and FFS and body contouring and more, I fucking hate this shit I can not fucking afford it period.

u/[deleted] • 15 points

I can’t even put into words how much pain and dysphoria my shoulders cause me. Posts like this give me hope that I can fix them one day, even if it’ll take a large sacrifice on my end. In a financial sense, because I’m still paying debt from FFS/GRS.

u/wyrecharm • 4 points

I know what you mean. I definitely took on more debt than I should have for this, but totally worth it. Now that I did it, hypothetically I'd rather go bankrupt than go back to how I was before,

u/Adorable_Degree_7277 • 8 points

Thank you so much for all the info. I have been considering this surgery for a few years now, how much was it if I may ask ?

u/[deleted] • 7 points

From the linked post, about 40k

u/[deleted] • 2 points

she also said that the scapula shaving added to its cost so for the reduction it should be 23k or less

u/Ancient_Lettuce_9737 • 8 points

Uhhh so lucky I have broad af shoulders and they ruin so much for me! If u don’t mind answering, how much was the procedure?

u/Bubbly_Ad_9414 • 4 points

So happy for you darling 😻

u/wyrecharm • 3 points

Tysm :)

u/EricaRA75 • 4 points

Thank you so much for such an awesome write up. I'm in the UK, did you have to do much looking to find a surgeon who would do it?

u/wyrecharm • 6 points

To me it was an easy decision because there's only two surgeons in North America who do it, and only Dr. Rogers in LA does it with longitudinal screws instead of plates (as far as I can tell), so he was the choice. I live in NY by the way, on the opposite coast 6.5 hours away, so distance had nothing to do with the decision. Considering the cost I would have flown across the globe if it meant getting the best possible version of the procedure.

u/EricaRA75 • 1 points

Totally with you on this, getting on to a plane is the least of my concerns when it comes to getting the best surgery. Would that be the sort of thing you claim for on your medical insurance?

u/robotic_valkyrie • 3 points

You look great, congratulations!

u/[deleted] • 3 points

Wow, this is amazing work, I plan on reading all that but I just wanna ask, does it hurt or feel easier to break something?

u/wyrecharm • 3 points

No! Mostly I had to be super careful especially for the first month, but now I feel just fine and my activity level is back to normal. I suspect that if anything it would be harder to break my clavicles now, considering that they have titanium rods in them in addition to being fully healed. Not sure if that's a good thing or a bad thing in terms of resistance to blunt trauma impacts.

u/infrequentthrowaway • 2 points

2 questions: Did you take any before and after measurements? How much did it cost?

u/wyrecharm • 3 points

I did. I'm 168cm tall (just over 5' 7") and before, my biacromial shouder width seemed to be a little over 15" (which was right at the male average for my height). It feels too good to be true, but it SEEMS like I'm even more than an inch smaller now, somewhere around 14" , which is right at the female average for my height, if not smaller!

My mom is 5'5" and I've measured her bideltoidal width... we now seem to measure exactly the same, which is cool. FWIW gendered anthropomorphic measurement averages are available here: https://anthro.cs.uni-freiburg.de

It's also obvious with my clothing. I could never by small tops before even if my chest seemed the right size because they would be tight in the shoulders. Now small tops fit me perfectly. It's a dream, frankly.

Cost: About $37k. For me this was a personal loan.

u/Beyondnonbinary • 2 points

It looks beautiful. Where did you do it and how did you research it?

u/Beyondnonbinary • 2 points

and sorry, one further question...do you think it also reduced the size of your upper rib cage?

u/wyrecharm • 3 points

This was with Leif Rogers in LA; research was pretty much all snooping around on reddit, but from what I can tell there are only two surgeons in North America who do it, and between the two, only Rogers seems to do it without requiring plates on the bone which would need to be removed later.

I didn't reduce the size of the rib cage itself, but certainly the *impression* of the size of my overall upper body is certainly reduced, which is arguably as important. Also, possibly, my breasts are slightly closer together.

u/Beyondnonbinary • 2 points

I love it. I am speaking to them. Thank you for the reco. This was always one of my most important surgeries, but I got scared off by what I thought was some seriously long and painful recovery.

My biggest question is how did you eat after? Did someone have to feed you for a while? And I would be flying in. How can you imagine dealing with a suitcase after surgery. How long before you can move your arms comfortably?

And have you regained the full range of motion you had before?

u/wyrecharm • 3 points

Great!

Eating was no problem actually. This was one of my concerns too... eating and using the bathroom alone, but they consider it be OK to use one's arms as long as you're very careful, especially for the first couple weeks.

They expect someone to be with you the day of the surgery and preferably the whole time you're in town thereafter (about a week), mainly to drive you back to the hotel and be on hand if you need anything. I pushed this a bit in that my husband stayed with me the first few days but then he had to fly back before me, so I was on my own in the airports. That was kind of pathetic tbh. They're VERY firm about warning you not to push or pull anything for the first few weeks, so I literally pushed my suitcase through the airports by pushing/kicking it with my leg. I relied on the kindness of other passengers for lifting to and from the overhead compartment, and I was sure to wear my arm slings the whole time as a visual indicator to others that I was in some need of assistance, even though the doctor said I could take it off after just a few days.

I'm trying to remember how long before I could move comfortably. It wasn't that it was painful so much as I had to remind myself not to overdo it. My arms were stiff and achy for the first month, but it wasn't too bothersome after that, and after a few months my range is motion is totally back to normal and there's no pain at all. To me the most significant milestone was when I got the go-ahead from the doctor to be able to start sleeping on my side again, which I think was after one month.

u/Beyondnonbinary • 2 points

I can so see you getting through the airport. That scene is what I kind of imagined. I am also a side sleeper, so that will be tough, but I think this is one body surgery that will make a huge difference

u/throwaway2019xc • 2 points

congratulations!!! i was wondering how the screws affect travelling / scanners at tsa?

u/Only-Trouble6305 • 1 points

Hi it’s been a year how has your experience been?

u/wyrecharm • 3 points

Everything is really good. From the perspective of healing it's like it never happend (i.e. I play tennis, other excercise, etc etc).

I should really post another update. There's a particular before/after pic I want to reproduce first.

u/Only-Trouble6305 • 1 points

Yesssss I think more before and after testimonies are needed for this procedure 🫶🏻🫶🏻 I’ve read that this surgery makes you slouch over after is that true?

u/Almyra-Caeli • 1 points

Hi, I'm sorry to bother, but I wanted your opinion on how you feel about your appearance from the back now that you've completed this procedure. I'm about to undergo the same operation with Dr. Rogers in a month and I'm very excited; however, I wonder how my shoulders will appear from behind. Since there's the slightest hunching effect by reducing the clavicle, does that make the span look smaller too? I've always been incredibly dysphoric about how my shoulder span makes me look super broad from behind. I wanna make sure that looks more narrow too.

u/PyroTracer • 1 points

Was there an option for a payment plan or split payments at Dr. Leif’s office? I can’t even begin to imagine just how much this surgery would improve my life, but sadly I am not well off in the slightest.

u/Content-Clue-4476 • 1 points

How do you feel after 1 year? Fully recovered? Is there any pain around shoulder area?

u/Influential_Urbanist • 1 points

I’m a year later here but I didn’t think you could ALSO get your shoulder blades reduced!, I’m deadass probably getting this eventually.

u/Jealous_Club_4315 • 1 points

How long can u have sex again after the surgery?

u/Influential_Urbanist • 1 points

I’ve wanted this for awhile and you’ve only reaffirmed my position, thank you.

u/Plastic-Journalist89 • 1 points

How are the scars now? Are they very noticeable?

u/[deleted] • 1 points

wow AMAZING!!!!!! how is the healing ? any pain?

u/Striking-Echo5910 • 1 points

Hi, sorry to post on such an old thread, but do you know if using screws instead of bolts to join the bones makes any difference to how much narrowing occurs?

u/ithacabored • 1 points

any updates on this? my whole life ive been complimented for my broad and thick shoulders...you can imagine how that feels. Do you know if insurance would have covered this? Anything good or bad to note?

u/FatGreedyCat • 1 points

I hope there will be rib cage shrinkage surgeries for mtf transgenders in the future.

u/janethesilverfish • 2 points

As far as I know they do exist just aren't mainstream and are slightly experimental? I think Dr. Slutzky offers it or is planning to

u/FatGreedyCat • 1 points

Thanks for your information. I know there are surgeries removing lower ribs to reduce waist size, but my goal is to reduce chest/underbust size. There are also surgeries on rib cage to treat chest deformities like pigeon chest, but I have not heard surgeries to shrink ribcage for mtf transgender.

u/janethesilverfish • 2 points

Okay yeah I don't think I've heard anything for upper ribs either, no :/